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Training Feedback

6 posts in this topic

First of all I want to thank the people who created and conducted this exercise. I know how much work it can be to create missions for multiplayer games.

There were positive aspects of it and unfortunately some negative ones.

Things I liked:

It was a good way to get into the required ArmA mods and to get the basics down. Getting the necessary stuff to work, primarily ACRE, and even even encountering some issues with it and learning how to fix them on the fly is definitely important before any real mission. Also the short rundown on the medical system is not to be underestimated. The shooting drills helped too since the gun behaviour seems to partially differ from vanilla ArmA a lot. Especially with the LMG's.


Things I didn't like:

The chaos and interruptions caused by certain people who just went out of line and behaved like it was the Upperclass Twit of the Year competition.

After I got downed for the third time by a 'friendly' grenade in a matter of minutes, I was close to leaving the server because I don't support this kind of trollfest. The random and unconnected chatter as well as the ongoing fooling around - like hijacking target vehicles and driving around or shooting weapons just for fun - was distracting. Unfortunately, because of this, I didn't got all the info out of the training that there was. Sometimes I couldn't even understand the instructor because of the chatter. Or right after the grenade incident I couldn't hear most of the things that were being said because it was so silent. I assume this is a feature of a mod, that you hear badly after an explosion very close to you(?).

I think such behaviour is kinda disrespectful to the people who put time and effort into this mission and to a lesser extend to the people who attend the mission and want to do it properly.

There are times for shits and giggles but there are also times to behave like a grown up and be serious. And a training exercise as well as a mission should fall under the latter category in my opinion.


Things I would improve:

First and foremost I want to suggest that we have a more disciplined approach of doing this. ArmA is a military sim and, in a way, we should reflect that while playing it. I'm not saying we should do a "Yes Sir; No Sir" routine. Just be serious, stay on topic and try not to ruin the experience for others.

Players should spawn with only the necessary equipment, like the radio, and receive weapons and especially grenades only at the designated practice areas. This would help to increase the discipline too.

On the pistol training course, and all other weapon courses, there should be a crate where the weapons and a sufficient amount of ammuniton is stored so that they don't have to be placed on the ground later on.

Aditionally to the LMG training it would make sense to also have the opportunity to practice with other weapons such as the M16 or M4 with grenade launcher. I don't think that, if we run a proper mission, we will be having an auto rifleman for every other player. ;)

Corresponding with the previous point. I see an opportunity for more specialised training exercises like combat tactics, formations, suppression fire and movement, forrest and urban fighting, combat medic, specialist (repairs) etc.

A grenade practice range which everyone must pass. This would ensure that people know how to throw grenades and therefore don't accidentally throw them at the wrong places. This is especially important because the grenade behaviour in ArmA differs so much from other games. Think of something like the one in MoH Pacific Assault where you had to throw grenades in barrels or through windows, hitting the specified targets.


Perhaps we could come up with some task ill-disciplined people would have to do?

Something like this:


Cheers. :)


Edited by marLeo

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Hello MarLeo,


The constructive criticism is extremly important to us in our ability to be able to improve to which we do appreciate.

A few things just to lay down first, the training mission was constructed a while back and has had to have a few things added and changed in order to get this to work, coupled with the issues we were having before didn't really help matters (neither did the shooting range not working as we had intended and couldn't complete in time). Me and @[BL] Hannibal have very little time to thoroughly test through missions and the training mission, this is not really an excuse but we try to satisfy people with atleast having a mission a week (if we were to test we would have 1 every 2 weeks to allow for everything to be working as intended).


We had been meaning to do this mission last week to which it was working "Perfectly" as intended, the mods then screwed with what we were intending to do (the who-har with CBA_A3 as which you can see on the steam dicussions for the mod itself) which never helped. This is by no means us trying to come up with an excuse but it didn't help us at all and took the time for sorting out the mission for us (We usually spend about 2-3 hours together with @[BL] Hannibal working in the background when he can as the main mission maker at the moment as I learn).


We have a short time to perfect a mission together but the feedback is much welcome and help a lot more than you think ;)

The Training mission I agree with you was spoilt by a very scarce amount of people which caused a lot of learning to be missed (and time), the sound issue with the quietening we will look into as this shouldn't be active (atleast not the high pitched screeching you would get from a loud explosion).

With regards with things to add and improve we will work on mission wise, not a problem we will definitly look into it and improve as mentioned (as was supposed to be but was cut short by lack of time).


What I would like to do if @[BL] Hannibal agrees is to offer private training sessions for those who are interested and did not get what they were looking for out of the mission (that and the shooting range) so we can tailor these to people who would like to learn certain things without the trolling that seemed to be happening by a few people, this also means we can focus on the certain aspects they are looking to either improve or learn (Marksmanship training will not be offered as this is a reserved slot we give to those who are deserving and show some restraint, this is not just a skill based on how well you shoot but is a factor).


We missed some parts of the training as we did not have time to fully complete or did not have time to complete due to quite frankly fucking around by a certain few. I can only apologise for this but it shouldn't really be us apologising, I am just devils advocating this.


Also to note sometimes me and @[BL] Hannibal miss some events in order to work on missions for you guys, so when you see us in the officer room we are more than likely discussing ideas or working on a mission ... please don't annoy us, we are working.


TL:DR - Agreed with distractions being an issue, we have little time to devlope everything but work towards it will all our effort we can put into it (we are gamers too this is our wind down time after work), MarLeo's ideas have been taken onboard and we will try to improve these when we have time to. We will now be working on a mission but those who feel they have missed training might be able to request a private training session for anything they feel they missed or would like to know.


Yours apologetically,


The Shovel King "Kator Viridian", Emperor of the Land of the Rising Shovel



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You don't have to apologise for the small problems within the mission itself and certainly not for the misbehaviour of some individuals. I'm not criticizing that the crate at the pistol range wasn't working as intended. I just mentioned it as a thing to keep in mind for future enhancement. Apart from the mentioned problems I enjoyed the training and would be up for more.


As I said, I know how time consuming it can be to build missions and that time is spare, so I'm more relaxed when it comes to bug within the mission itself. It's only a hobby after all. If everyone stays cool about it, it shouldn't be a problem.

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As stated we will be working to iron those things out so we don't have these issues in further training sessions with newer people and the tailor made training sessions using the training map.


Thank you for being understanding on the time matters, we will be looking towards manouver and tactical training more into the tailor made training if people would like to learn them as well as towards the leadership roles (we do have a shortage of both Squad level and Fireteam leadership people, this would be useful if anyone would like to volunteer towards them).

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I will add that the training mission has been designed for 1-2 individuals to take the course at a time. Most of the ranges are 2 firing bays max. When training people we normally do 1 instructor 1 trainee and then we do a variety of courses for people depending on what specialities we want/need.

Individuals messing about was a big problem. When editing the video some of Hannibal's explanations I have had to cut bits out over 8 times in one speech. If we do training in smaller groups then members can get the training they need at their own pace and without interruptions.

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